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That State Up North

Just eyeballing it, what is your general impression as the the relative percentage which genetics plays a role in ultimate size determination of a pumpkin? I just want to see what the general pumpkin populus thinks in regards to this. Make your prediction, is it 20% genetic, 80% other factors, or maybe 60% genetic and 40% other random factors. What do you think it is?

Nic Welty

p.s. maybe if I get 100 responses to the survey I will post what I think the ratio is

12/11/2003 4:28:44 AM

Knopp, Germany

33% Genetic, 66% Other(soil/weather/pruning, etc)

12/11/2003 4:36:07 AM

Menomonie, WI ([email protected])

15% Genetic, 60% other 25% luck. Sometimes it is more luck. Unless you are a grower that consectutively throws 1000 pounders.

12/11/2003 4:45:11 AM

Udine, Italy

25% genetic (talking about AG strain, obvious), 75% growing conditions. This does it means that genetic is not important (25% make a difference between a 800 or 1000lbs) but for ex. explain why I produced a 290 lbs with a seed that have a progeny average of 708lbs.
Paolo Ermacora

12/11/2003 5:48:51 AM

Udine, Italy

sorry for the mistake the correct version is
25% genetic (talking about AG strain, obvious), 75% growing conditions. This does not it means that genetic is not important (25% make a difference between a 800 or 1000lbs) but for ex. explain why I produced a 290 lbs with a seed that have a progeny average of 708lbs.
Paolo Ermacora

12/11/2003 6:02:17 AM

Itzetown City

I would say fifty fifty. However the final product depends on too much factors, in order to commit itself there proportionally and the one factor did't work without the other. On the other hand not only the appearance, size is genetically fixed but also the metabolisms. Additional I state that also the genetics of the pollinator plant plays a role, i think with the Phytoplasma in the pollen growth hormones will more or less transfer and affect the fruit growing.

12/11/2003 6:18:20 AM

Cornwall UK.(50N 5W)300ft.

We quite often see that in a given year a growers pumpkins are of a similar size to each other but when comparing one year to another variation is often greater.
I'd say 25% genetic,75% growing conditions.

12/11/2003 7:53:24 AM

New Hampshire

20 Genetic 80 other

12/11/2003 8:07:10 AM

Hilpoltstein, Bavaria, Germany

40% genetic

12/11/2003 8:11:59 AM

Long Island,New York

I have not grown enough plants to offer a valid opinion. But, based upon what Ive seen and experienced Id say the genetics end is important but the absolute easiest variable to control or obtain to the point of being competitive. Growing environment is at least 75% if you consider growing environment to be grower ability ,patch conditions, and mother nature................G

12/11/2003 8:33:12 AM

canal winchester ohio

After seeing the growth I wasn't able to get a handle on when I grew the 845 Bobier this season I would say 60% genetics & 40% other factors. With the largest part of the other factor being your soil.

12/11/2003 8:35:07 AM

Brillion Wisconsin

25% good genetics, 25% warm weather, 50% perfect soil/water

12/11/2003 8:40:15 AM

Wood River, Nebraska

25% genetics, 75% other factors

12/11/2003 8:48:26 AM

Montoursville, PA

50% seed selection 50% management skills.
Roughly one third 33 1/3 % of top 30% of huge top third fruit weights in lbs. appear to be from seed carrying Lloyd genetics while the ballance are seed that may have undiscovered excellent genetics. Weighing all the knowns and unknowns it appears that the odds of growing a whopper (a fruit in the top 30% of all grown) from seed selected at random might be as high as 50/50. Management and grower skills are at least a big fifty percent of the success ratio in my mind.

12/11/2003 9:11:27 AM

Leicester, NY

50% genetics. Soil not properly balanced, together with Mother Nature not cooperating makes for a very ordinary pumpkin patch, regardless of genetics.

12/11/2003 9:12:47 AM

Utah

I believe that there is no correct answer .... it depends on where you live (climate- bugs- disease- etc), how good your soil is, and how good are your growing techniques.
if you grow in Death Valley and don't take care of your plants then then genetics plays zero percent because you are not going to grow anything. If you grow in inclosed fully regulated green house with perfect soil and perfect growing techniques then genetics play 100%.
But as you know all of us are somewhere inbetween. and that varies greatly. I'm not trying to rain on your parade but i think that's the way it is. It's different for each grower. and don't let my post keep others from answering the question.
I live in a hot, dry, high elevation climate that seems to be more susceptible to viruses than normal. So I think genetics play less of a role than in other places. So to answer your question for me I'll say 50%.

12/11/2003 9:37:18 AM

Edmonton, Canada

In my opinion, there is way too much importance placed on genetics. It does play a factor, but a small one.

10% genetics, 90% other factors.

12/11/2003 10:13:43 AM

what do they say now....good seeds, good luck, good soil, and good weather, right?

definitely less than 50% seeds i think...i'll be generous and say 25%...
rest is dirt, care, and plant management. weather...ya, that counts too if it's really bad or really good.


I think it's funny how we all say that seeds don't count a lot in this survey, yet we piss and moan and complain about getting the seeds we want all winter long, and pay hundreds of dollars for them, and send out countless bubble packs, etc. But I guess every little bit helps when you're trying to get a big pumpkin.

12/11/2003 10:24:49 AM

Md/ Usa

10% gentics 25% which flower you choose to encourage,
50% weather and soil 15% luck

12/11/2003 10:26:13 AM

Key West, FL

20% Genetics, 30% Luck picking the "silver bullet" seed and weather, 50% grower skill (soil, skill, etc.)

12/11/2003 10:35:24 AM

Morris, Connecticut

20% genetics 80% other stuff. Should be noted that the genetic factor has become more significant over the last 5-10 years. I think the percentages will lean more and more towards the genetic side of things in the future...

12/11/2003 10:46:52 AM

[email protected]

A trend is developing here.

This is not a one part question. So the correct 2 part answer is:

1.) 100% Evironmental when growing the ideal genetics.
2.) 100% Genetic potential when growing in the ideal environment.

Personally I believe it is much easier to get the genetics than it is to manage all the environmental & cultural factors that we must concern ourselves with. So the real world answer should probably be 10% Genetics/90% Environment.

That said, two 845's growing side by side in the same patch & receiving (in theory) the same care never throw the same weights. Luck of the draw on the genetics again.

But for sure, 99.9% of our time & effort should be applied to the environmental factors that have the potential to limit growth.

IMHO- Steve

12/11/2003 11:21:14 AM

South Western Pa

75% nature, 25% nurture. A Chihuahua is highly unlikely to produce an offspring the size of a Great Dane.

Mark

12/11/2003 11:40:14 AM

canal winchester ohio

Brigitte has a great point, it the genetics is as low as some think why try so hard to get a "hot" seed.

12/11/2003 11:42:02 AM

Indiana

I think a lot more of it is genetic than we generally think. If it wasnt, we would have a lot less variability in our patches. I am going to venture that somewhere around 35-40% is genetic. A lot of the newer growers especially first year growers try to hard and harm their pumpkins more than they help. I think most first year growers should be able to top 700 lbs if they can refrain from doing something "stupid". Been there done that first year 373...LOL.

Tom Beachy

12/11/2003 11:46:07 AM

[email protected]

Hot seeds at auction: $500 (723 Bobier- how much hotter does it get?)

Material cost & labor to have the perfect patch? Let's be honest & include the cost of the land too.

Thoughts?

12/11/2003 11:48:56 AM

Deer Park, WI

When you look at what influences fruit size, there are only two factors, genetics and environment. Therefore logic tells us its 50-50. To me, luck is defined as when opportunity meets skill, therefore i catergorize this in the environment catergory.

Now, Im not so sure you can shift this ratio beyond 50-50. Lets say you bust your ass and optimize your enviroment to be flawless. Pumpkin heaven per se. You might think the ratio has shifted towards environment, but it hasnt. Cuz, under ideal environmental conditions, you will maximize the genetic potential of the seed. Here's a little chart ive developed to help visualize this:

Great seed, poor environment=average pumper
Great seed, great enviroment=big pumper
Poor seed, great environment=average pumper
Poor seed, poor environment=small pumper

12/11/2003 11:50:57 AM

Deer Park, WI

Welty- 100 responses or not you gotta give us yer opinion. This is a loaded question and you cant leave us hangin.

12/11/2003 12:05:36 PM

i'm going with tremor on the two part answer.....assuming you have the "ideal" environment....that being proper care, weather, dirt....then the seed you grow is going to affect the size pumpkin ya get....

if you have the perfect seed...and i mean the best single genetic potential seed from the entire stock....then the environmental factors are going to limit its size....

sometimes i think i think too much! but to say it again guys, it's simple nature vs. nurture that you learn in 9th grade biology class.

12/11/2003 12:07:54 PM

Saegertown Pa.

If the soil is close to being right and you manage the plant properly 50% genetics. If you dont have your soil right and poor managment it doesn't matter what seed you plant.

12/11/2003 12:11:54 PM

Calif

I think i would have to go 50/50 or call it a wash. Because there is no fixed measure. all the seeds in a pumpkin are different. And all the environments are different. But if you could hand out a genetically equal seed or clone to all growers . Then it would be environment that shaped the difference in size and weight . MB

12/11/2003 12:12:49 PM

chihuahua produce a great dane mark?!?! LOL now that's something to think about....

12/11/2003 12:14:41 PM

Atlanta, Georgia

I would have to say 99 percent genetics but the other 1 percent needs to be great plant protection and soil prep.
Just goes to show that the total 100 percent is a lot of work in my not very important opinion...
I should know having grown small pumpkins from the 582 Hester this year and the year prior from the 845Bobier00UOW.
Happy holidays to all!...except the folks down under...to you guys "GET TO WORK!" ha ha...
Michel

12/11/2003 12:30:08 PM

San Diego

I would say 50% genetic, 40% grower knowledge and climate, 10% luck. Jim

12/11/2003 12:36:03 PM

Western NY

without getting into nature vs. nurture, i'll try to make it quick post:

25% genetic

12/11/2003 12:48:35 PM

Choctaw, OK

I am going to say 40% genetic and 60% other(weather, evnironment, soil, luck, etc)...so many factors its hard to even give it a percentage.
case

12/11/2003 12:52:01 PM

Webster, NY

I'm still new and learning. I'd almost have to go with a 50/50 mix.

12/11/2003 12:54:26 PM

Kuna, Id.

So if I were to plant the 21 Beachy for 10 yrs and the best it did was 21#.
And in a patch next to it I plant the 1097 Beachy and the best it did was 1097#
Now lets assume tho soil in the 21 patch and 1097 patch was perfect and the same to a tee, they got the same water ferts and weather.
Does this mean the genetics of the 1097 will produce bigger all the time?
Now after looking at Andy Wolfs soil data I see lots of large pumpkins were grown in not so great of soil. When I say not so great I mean by the standards we read about.
Sense I'm still learning about both soil and genetics I would have to say 70% genetics and 30% growing conditions (soil, mother nature, and what cuss words you use in patch)
Ken

12/11/2003 12:57:55 PM

In the shade - PDX, OR

This is a great thread - thanks Nick


I'll go with 35% Genetics & 65 % Environment and Luck.

Mike Brock, Qunn and Joe all have great points above.

12/11/2003 1:24:08 PM

No Place Special

25% Seed, 25% soil, 25% Hard work and 25% luck.
Mike Frantz

12/11/2003 1:24:42 PM

Wisconsin

This almost an irrelevant question. You need both - seeds with the genetic potential to grow big (I bet there are a lot of these) plus you need to put them in the right environment. In that sense it is 50/50.

The more important question is where should people put their time, effort and money. In this regard I would say - 5% seeds, 95% environment. The problem is that we really don't understand the genetics very well and picking seeds is largely a guessing game.

The heavy hitters are usually the people that have learned to maximize the environmental factors (much more so than the people that have learned to pick seeds the best).

12/11/2003 1:25:30 PM

Deer Park WA

I have had poor AG seeds (store bought) grown in the ultimate pampered environment (soil, water, green houses, shelterd sunny location, spare no expence) and they still produced very well. I think its about 75% environment/experience, and 25% genetics. Some of the hottest seeds I have grown produced splitters and quiters just like the run of the mill seeds.

12/11/2003 1:48:05 PM

[email protected]

25 % Genetics, 25% enviroment 50% experience

12/11/2003 2:01:28 PM

New Hampshire

Go to AGGC and look up those top proven seeds 846,845,723 805 ect. The first thing I notice is at least 75% of those top weights have top notch proven growers names after them. Good post and comments

12/11/2003 2:22:13 PM

memphis ny

40% genetics, 30% soil, 30% mother nature

12/11/2003 2:22:27 PM

Caceres, mid west of Spain

In my humble experience I noticed, with the same environment and care and no particular problems, a difference of 24 % of weigh between two different seeds of AGP, and it could be more of course. So for me, and talking only on AGP plants, at least you can considerer 30% genetics, 70% others. But if you talk on pumpkins of every kind, is clearly 90% genetics.

12/11/2003 2:42:36 PM

Applegate, Oregon

A loaded question Nic, and after glancing at the genetics section of HTGWGP III, one would get the idea that genetics is greater than 50%. Now, if you are talking about pumpkins in general, then genetics will completely determine the ability of a pumpkin to become "giant" as only a seed with Atlantic Giant genetics will do it. Now as for AG's, I'd say the percentage of genetic influence will vary depending upon environment. For example, some lines tolerate heat better than others, etc.... Overall, I would say it is 50/50, as Joe made a good point above.

12/11/2003 2:49:58 PM

South Hill, Virginia

I think I agree with Quinn. The two are not mutually exclusive so how much genetics matters is partly a function of environment.

12/11/2003 2:53:42 PM

wilmington,ma.

Lets look at the weights of the past 10 years.
Now tell me genetics hasent played a large part.
50/50 for me.

12/11/2003 3:08:32 PM

ipswich, ma usa

40% genetics 60% everything else.

John (5150)

12/11/2003 3:21:51 PM

Ga.

40% Genetics

12/11/2003 3:32:59 PM

Stouffville

genetics is important as hell, getting decent soil is not that hard. for instance back in 93 as a second year grower i got some manure, and new top soil to expand my patch and added some 15-15-15 fertilizer, and got an 832UOW which wanted to keep growing but lost out to a dill ring, the plant had a 700 on it too and was only 600ft^2.i stopped caring for the plant about August 20th when the big guy was 400est and the smaller one was about 130lbs, cause the big one developed a crack in the back that i though would go all the way through. I even tried to slow the growth by cutting half the vine feeding the big one(i was a pretty stupid novice) but the fruit still kept growing 25+lbs/day. So this fruit kept growing and growing even without much water and a notch in the vine, in soil which was just some topsoil with manure, regular chemical fertilizer and a little peatmoss. No matter what i've tried I've never had a plant repeat the growth of that one.

12/11/2003 4:12:05 PM

Syracuse, NY

sooo many great and logical answers, but i like Mike Frantz's answer the best---all four wheels on the ground, ehhh, buddy? i agree, in other words.
without all of them in substantial amounts, we are nowhere in those patches.'pal

12/11/2003 4:55:52 PM

Paradise Mountain, New York

15% Genetics
30% Good Balance Soil
30% Weather
10% A Good Fertilizer Program
15% Hard Work, Insect Control & Experience

12/11/2003 5:18:09 PM

Indiana

Im just happy to know that i Grew a bigger pumpkin than Tom my first year.
Steve

12/11/2003 5:33:02 PM

Woodburn, Indiana

99% genetics 1% other factors

12/11/2003 5:35:06 PM

Ontario

Depends on pumpkin size

500 pounds 90% genetics 10 %soil
800 pounds 50 50
1000 pounds 30 70 soil
1200 pounds 20 80
Like someone said if your soil is not right you could have a 723 and it will only grow 500 pounds more people need to concentrate on their soil and not the hot seeds

drew

12/11/2003 6:12:57 PM

Cornwall UK.(50N 5W)300ft.

Take a look at the genetics of the 1385.
783 Daletas 00 = 500 Hebb 96 x 801.5 Stelts 97.
That cross could have been made in 1998 instead of 2000.
So the genetics were out there to grow a 1385 in 1999.
Why didn't it happen?

12/11/2003 6:47:01 PM

Paradise Mountain, New York

I would have to agree with Drew 100%

12/11/2003 7:18:37 PM

[email protected]

Very good point! I'd love to know the answer to this one.

Was it because Steve Daletas hadn't grown that cross the way he grew that cross in 2003? Has Steve happened upon better management practices? Or was this cross just waiting to be discovered all along & cultural practices had nothing to do with it?

12/11/2003 7:18:48 PM

Mastic Beach, New York

Drew made a good point..i'll say 60% genetics and 40% soil

12/11/2003 7:39:19 PM

Tipp City, Ohio

If pumpkins are made up of 80% or more of water then genetics could only be at most 20%.

I would say that soil condition and enviromental conditions play a larger role in the size.

12/11/2003 8:50:42 PM

Key West, FL

I meant that it wa 50% genetics but half of the 50 is just luck picking the right seed from the pumpkin. Like Steve said, if you grow 2 845s next to each other, they wont be the same weight. So you try to get the seed with the good genetics and hope its one of the good one.

12/11/2003 9:32:08 PM

Utah ([email protected])

60/40.

12/11/2003 10:31:30 PM

Jackson Twp, Ohio

I'm going to have to say that It depends on 52.5% genetics, 20% Dirt, and 27.5 % on an experience factor which includes experience, luck, and just plain old stupidity.

Nick

12/12/2003 7:46:44 AM

Long Island,New York

Why do I get the feeling its 100% genetics until after the OVGPG seed auctions are over?.........G

12/12/2003 7:52:34 AM

Garden State Pumpkins

Until you get your soil right and irrgation up to par with a good fertilizing program and move to New Hampshire don't waste your money or time begging for good seeds...Get your experience in and your soil right then it's tme for the genetics to get the maximum from your hard work. I'm with Drew on this and tremor on the seeds. When you have it optimized go for the seed best suited for your climate and growing conditions. guess that puts me at 50 50....soil,climate and seed all contribute to size.

12/12/2003 7:54:37 AM

Pumpkintown, SC

"general impression as to the relative percentage which genetics plays a role in ultimate size determination?"
Well, how does one answer such a question?
I'll choose to take this tack...
For me, I know, from year to year as the season plays itself out, the seed/seeds with the "best" genetics always rises to the top.
When we all grow multiple pumpkins in our patches our best pumpkins haven't had some sort of silver spoon that has made them surpass the others. That seed's individual genetic makeup is what was responsible. Most of us have had "that plant(fruit)," the one that "wouldn't stop growing," the one left unattended to, stumpless, leafless or diseased that still kept going and going and produced a quality pumpkin in spite of it all.
"In Spite Of It All." This is a Readers Digest description of my patch. Yet, because of quality genetics I've grown state records in giant clay pots(so-to-speak). I am of the opinion that genetics is the king. For the ultimate sized pumpkin we must have the optimally arranged genes. Genetics wins! 75/25 BF

12/12/2003 12:06:29 PM

Knopp, Germany

I believe that if the question had been worded to say that you have an absolutley perfect patch (soil), you know exactly how to prune, your weather will be perfect, then of course the genetics play 100% a role. However, with all of the "other" factors, to include us human beings trying to help the plant/fruit, I stick by the 33% I said initially. We can not control the weather, or during mid season a blossom end split, or any of the other "luck" that we all hope for. Under perfect conditions, the genetics are the only role left.....100%.

12/12/2003 12:22:43 PM

northern indiana

100% !
Once a seed is planted, the plant will have to play the hand it has been delt. The soil it is in, the skill of the grower caring for it, the comming weather for the season are the hand it is delt. Genetics will determine how large a fruit will grow with what the plant has to work with. Lesser skill, soil, and weather will hamper its efforts. Greater skill, soil, and weather will aid its efforts.
But in the end a seeds genes will cause the plant to forth its best effort acording to their instructions. Your efforts at soil amendments, fert, watering, protecton, pruning, ect, and the weather, will make the finall determination as to how close the plant comes to maximizing its potential.
Maybe I am wrong, maybe not, but at this time this is my humble opinion.
Eric

12/13/2003 12:10:27 AM

Southeast Wisconsin

Definitely genetics. A Prizewinner pumpkin no matter how well grown will only get to be about 300-400 pounds - no more. Same thing with Alantic Giant pumpkins, if you have a strain that was developed 10 to 15 years ago the chances of it developing into a 1000 lb fruit would be very slim. In my mind you need the relationship is about 60% genetics and 40% environment. Good question

12/13/2003 1:18:46 PM

Paradise Mountain, New York

It's not all in the Genetica. One very well known heavy hitter told me that you can yake amost any Atlantic Giant Pumpkin seed with soil that is perfect ( very well balanced ) and you can get at least a 600 - 700 pounder

12/13/2003 4:42:48 PM

Leicester, NY

PumpkinBrat,
It would be fun if we could give that heavy hitter one of today's seeds, a seed from 10 years ago and seed from 15 years ago. Put them in the perfect soil and see if they all grow to be 700+ pounders..Joe P.

12/13/2003 6:01:30 PM

ontario

75% soil and cultural growing practices.....take 25% remaining and you have a 50-50 chance with the seed,even top seeds have duds and you can get lucky with a unproven one with great genetics..........

12/24/2003 10:30:15 AM

Cincinnati,OH

I'd say 60/40 I don't think you have to have "a hot seed" to bust a big one but I would definetly look for seed that has grown 700lbs plus in the past. Without maximum nurture forget it. So I tip the scale to genetic because you have to start there.

12/26/2003 6:18:52 PM

[email protected]

Another 26 entires & Nic's gonna share the answer. Let's keep this one going!

12/26/2003 7:44:01 PM

Ontario

This is an unanswerable question. Any data presented could be disputed by outside factors such as weather, grower experence or if the damn dog got into the patch. There are lies, damn lies and then there are statistics that can be interpreted a thousand different ways to back whatever position you care to take. Common sense seems to back the argument that genetic factors are more important to the better growers but I don't think anyone is capable of putting a true percentage on all growers. One size does not fit all.

12/26/2003 10:47:27 PM

On top of Brush Mountain, Pa.

The smart thing to do is get the best seeds you can and then do the work. Somehow the best growers seem to have access to the best seeds. Joe Schmo is not growing an 846 Calai, a 723 Bobier or an 845 Bobier because he has great difficulty getting one of these seeds unless he is willing to pay several hundred dollars for one. I can tell you that in my patch there is no substitute for spending the time. To have the big one I am convinced it is like it says in the book. You need good seeds, good weather, good soil and good luck. A combination of these factors and as much knowledge as you can about growing techniques, bugs, diseases, pests etc will go a long way. I haven't been able to combine all of these yet but hope to.

1/4/2004 9:07:15 AM

Greencastle, PA

I think it's very hard to measure the effect of genetics at this point in time because every seed has it's individual DNA alignment, different from most if not all other seeds in the pumpkin and othe rpumpkins of the same genetic background. Obviously some seeds do do better than others, and it is caused by the genetics, but I think any seed has the potential to grow a 1000 pounder under the right conditions, therefor the best way to measure the effect of genetics is by consistancy in producing large fruit in different climates. Look at the 723, over 20 1000 pounders from all over the country, it's genetics obviously have a huge impact on the weight of the fruit, but other factors are just as important. I grew a 123.2 off of a 455.4 Andrews, an 85 est. off of the 611.5 Hester (although it had 9" walls), a 63* pounder off of the 968 Sproule, and a 30 pounde off of the 649 Dill (780 x 940 '98), small fruit for pumpkins with such great genes.
Tom

1/4/2004 6:10:03 PM

Greencastle, PA

If you could get multiple geneticly identical seeds and grow them in multiple different climates you could measure the effects of geneticts, but that's a very, very small chance of even finding 2 geneticly idebtical seeds.
tom

1/4/2004 6:12:36 PM

That State Up North

Well, sorry for the delay. I never had time to crunch the numbers to make an exact figure. But in general Drew Papez gave the answer that I beleive to be most correct. You have to understand distributions and patterns. I plant stuff in the field from a range of genetics and get a range of results. The better my soil, and the more care that is given to optimize the environment, the narrower the spread of fruit size, obviously retaining within the general good pool of genetics we have today. Sad to say for all my genetics ramblings, and efforts on genetics. The silver bullet isn't getting the magic seed, it is hard work and knowing how to take care of your giant. The major fraction is how you take care of it, genetics is fine tuning the equation.

Nic Welty

1/9/2004 7:17:44 PM

Newmarket, NH USA

I dont consider myself a heavy hitter. But I have worked very hard to obtain the top seeds to plant each year. And have been lucky enough to plant them each year.My 3 best so far are 786 743 and 740. My patch is in a low area that is a bit on the wet side and very cold early on in the season. My soil is pretty good as my soil test would indicate. I feel that soil is most everything. Not only what is in it but how warm it is how wet it is and everything about it plays a factor. I can say that for sure. I feel about 30% is genetic. I look at things such as splitting tendancy or prone to dill rings before I look at how many big ones it has grown. Each year new hot seeds come out because some growers are not afraid to take a chance on something totally new. I will do that this year and hope more growers do that as well it only makes the seed pool that much better for all of us. But soil first seed 2nd. Matt Mongeon

1/17/2004 5:32:30 PM

Nj

I think the equation goes more like this:

(1*1*1)- (1*1*1) = Result

For this 1 is 100% as in 1.00,

Genetics*Nutrients*Conditions - Disease*Pests*Mistakes = Result

100 percent in Genetics Nutrients and Conditions coupled with 0 percent in Disease, Pests, and Mistakes will lead you to the ULTIMATE Pumpkin. What that is, I don't know. :)

3/10/2004 1:57:33 AM