From

Location

Message

Date Posted

Nova Scotia

Hello Everyone!
Hope you all enjoyed another great pumpkin growing season. Quickly, on behalf of Howard Dill, I would like to say - patent or no patent, Howard Dill Enterprises still owns registered trademarks for 'Atlantic Giant' and 'Dill's Atlantic Giant'. No one can use these marks without written authorization by Howard Dill. Trademarks do not expire. We just filed a "notice of infringement" to ebay on 2 items violating our rights. One in particular had the audacity, unknown to us, come to our farm and take several photos of our giant pumpkin displays, use photos from our brochure and seed packet and then try to auction seed. They even removed "Howard Dill's" name from his sign, cut my 5 year old son Michael out of a photo, and eliminated our registered trademark symbol. Wow, we're trying to run a simple small seed business for everyone's enjoyment. Most growers respect our rights, of which we certainly appreciate. Thank you for your attention to this matter. Danny Dill
P.S. The grower from England has removed his seed for auction from ebay as of 1/2 hour ago.

11/4/2003 3:55:03 PM

Long Island,New York

Boy...leave out the 5 year old and see what happens !!...LOL...

11/4/2003 4:38:22 PM

Long Island,New York

(that was a joke by the way....)

11/4/2003 4:38:55 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Just an observation, nothing more and not taking anything away from the Dill's but I would then understand...
that means after the pvp expires you can sell the seed, you just can't call or label it under the names "Atlantic Giant" or "Dill's Atlantic Giant".
You could however call them "Bob's Big Seeds", "Giant Pumpkin Seeds", "Sasquatch Squash Seeds", or anything else, just not "Ag" or "Dill AG"
Correct?
BTW...I'm not one that's ever gonna sell seed. I may ask for packaging and postage but I won't be a seller.

11/4/2003 5:03:58 PM

Menomonie, WI ([email protected])

3M goes through this every once in awhile. If it looks like a post-it note, does the same thing as a post-it note,it is a post-it note. Respect the fact of the trademark, continue doing the friendly trading we have been doing.
Remember when doing trades who to trust, if it seems to good to be true, it is most likely a scam. Shannon

11/4/2003 5:44:47 PM

Webster, NY

Ask permission, and play fair. We learn these things in kindergarten and they still apply now. Thanks for the not Danny.

11/4/2003 6:08:57 PM

Oz

so the guy in england lied? tsk tsk more monkeys stealing!
im all in favor of making money. but not by out and out lies!

11/4/2003 6:56:56 PM

Oz

so would ebay # 2356644921 and ebay # 2357397690
be ok sellers?......................

11/4/2003 7:04:00 PM

Liverpool , England

I'll never buy or sell seed. Only seed that I pay for is through a lottery or auction to benefit societies.


Alun

11/4/2003 8:03:03 PM

Glenn: Knowing you, that was a joke in jest but your believe in truth. 6 cent's LOL but your right to option.

11/5/2003 8:27:25 PM

Long Island,New York

Poppy...You DON'T know me.

11/5/2003 8:41:14 PM

Omaha, NE (N41-15-42 )

Going back to the naming issue, what is the official scientific horticultural name for the Atlantic Giant? Curcubit Maximus?

11/5/2003 9:49:35 PM

Deer Park WA

JMattW, I think technically your right, the biblical definition is "Gourd"...

11/5/2003 11:32:57 PM

Deer Park WA

Glen, I have followed your posts for a long time, don't sweat it your ok in my book.

11/5/2003 11:34:15 PM

Omaha, NE (N41-15-42 )

I found it. The scientific name is Cucurbita Maxima

11/6/2003 8:04:26 AM

Stouffville

The Atlantic Giant is an interesting variety in that it produces a whole slew of completely different looking fruit. There are white ones, white ones with pink hue and green spots, yellow ones, creamy coloured ones, cantaloupers, non-cantaloupers with shiny skin, reddish and dark orange ones. Some smooth, some with deep ribs...

Is this the only variety 'defined' by size?

What makes all the different field pumpkin varieties distinct? I don't have much experience with them, but I know that different varieties exist from briefly looking at seed packets at garden centres

11/6/2003 10:02:48 AM

Montoursville, PA

The field pumpkin varieties are strain controlled by professional growers. They are carefully developed seed by only professional growers. That is why they produce what is shown on the seed packet.

The American Giant is so inter mixed with crosses of squash and so called pumpkins that it might better be called a Squashkin. The strains are in the genetics of the many crosses we individuals who are not closely or professionaly controlled make or let happen.

Some would claim our crosses are hybrid but they are not in the sense of being controlled and reliable. Some lines seem a bit more consistant than others. This is to be expected as long as hobby growers contribute to the crosses. When there is a profit motive large companies may work at genetics of the American Giants and be able to provide seed that will be largely producing the pictured fruit.

Right now we are a bunch of growers, many doing best they know how, but with absolutely no control of any previous years growing fruit.

Any genetic trait may appear or not appear from any given seed because we do not have absolute controlled development that would lead to purity or consistancy in any given seed.

That's my opinion. It's a craps shoot with at best predicted outcomes that may or may not come to pass. That is also what adds a heck of a lot of excitement and fun in the growing of these unpredictable onery things we call pumpkins if orange and squash if green.

I vote to grow squaskins and have only one class...for weight only.

That otta git things stirred up a little. :)

11/6/2003 11:05:58 AM

Stouffville

i think giants are all squash personally, since they are maximas, but we call certain coloured ones pumpkins since the fruit called 'field pumpkins' have mass appeal from use at halloween. Would some dude rather take his kid to a giant squash competition or a giant pumpkin competition? Or rather, which competition would his kid want to attend?

How is consistency achieved in varieties like the prizewinner? What breeding procedures are used? but i guess consistency is not always what we're after, since we are in fact trying to produce what could be called a new variety that produces bigger fruit than what is currently possible.

11/6/2003 11:47:15 AM

americans in general want to eat squash, and use pumpkins for decorations. therefore, giant pumpkins are more appealing.

jammerama....if you have a "new variety" that is consistent and produces big fruit, wouldn't that consistency be of value? perhaps it is what somgrowers are after, but some people prefer a surprise outcome.

11/6/2003 12:14:31 PM

Stouffville

how does one achieve this sort of consistency, what i'm meaning to say is that competivie giant pumpkin growers are constantly trying to make new crosses and thus new varieties that produce bigger and bigger fruit. this may be achieved by growing strains that are not completely consistent size wise,

Haha i'm confusing myself...I think as i write, oh well may lead to some sort of discussion.

think about this hypothetical situation: what if a guy got a Howden seed and grew the offspring year after year, growing only seeds from the biggest one, and only self and sib pollinating it, and after 20 years of doing this he could grow 200lb field pumpkins. Would these be called Howden or could he call it something else? Would it be a new variety?

11/6/2003 12:27:26 PM

Stouffville

consistency is of great value,
we are satisfied now with a seed that consistently produces 900+

tomorrow this bar will most likely be raised somewhat

if we could grow all the 355.6* Dill '85 seeds today using modern practices, what do you think it would max out at?

11/6/2003 12:39:00 PM

Stouffville

i'm starting to like surprise more and more, next year if i grow i'll most likely grow only my own seed, which currently involve open-pollinated crosses of the 850.5 Eaton, the 1020 and 1058 Papez and the 1092 Burke. Using these seeds as a starting point i'm curious what sort of outcomes I can get. I may also throw in a seed from a squash that i grew a while back if I can get it to germinate which has some 900.5 lyons in it. I'm missing 946.5 Geerts genetics though

11/6/2003 12:55:40 PM

what the heck is this.........next year "if i grow"

IF?!!!?!?! IF?!!?!?

11/6/2003 12:58:46 PM

Stouffville

hahaha,well I don't know where I'll be living, I just finished University last spring and who knows where my job search will land me. Maybe I'll try to grow a bonzai giant pumpkin plant in a pot in a basement appartment...yes, yes!

11/6/2003 1:10:27 PM

Stouffville

unless the 2002 490 est (1058x open) got it on with the 850.5, then i'll have the geerts in it.

hmmm, bloody open-pollinated crosses!

11/6/2003 6:30:43 PM

Hamburg, NY

Variety Naming Guidelines
Here are some of the guidelines for naming new varieties to comply with the Federal Seed Act.

A variety can only have one name.

The same name cannot be given to more than one variety of the same kind or a closely related kind. Kinds of the same species such as pumpkin and squash, field corn and sweet corn, and garden bean and field bean cannot have varieties with the same name. Closely related kinds that are known to intercross such as wheat and triticale cannot have varieties with the same name.

A variety name cannot be misleading such as a name that is similar to an existing name but differs only in spelling or punctuation.

Varieties with names derived from the name of an existing variety must be closely related to the existing variety.

Variety names may contain trademarks, but the trademark status is lost in the sense that anyone marketing seed of that variety must use the entire variety name including the trademark.

A trademark symbol or registered trademark symbol cannot be displayed in the variety name.

A trademark by itself cannot be a variety name and a variety name cannot be trademarked.

11/8/2003 9:05:13 AM

Md/ Usa

looks like Howard needs no insult intended needs read the law because he has been paying for only a name "Atlantic giant" and "dills Atlantic giant "that is a name only and does not cover the seed.
"A trademark by itself cannot be a variety name and a variety name cannot be trademarked."
if could it would allow any one to have permanent monopoly
on seed type because even after the pvp expired no one could label the vareity with correct name without getting sued.

11/8/2003 10:00:40 AM

[email protected]

Howard is free to introduce a new variety if he can differentiate it from, but prove it's relation to, the original Dill's Atlantic Giant & name the new version Dill's Atlantic II (2), or something like that. We do it all the time in the Turfseed industry, Especially when the original has been a big hit & has responded well to addition genetic input. His Trademark goes on forever with or without the PVP.

11/8/2003 10:40:22 AM